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« Taxing matters | Main | Made in America »

Jul 17, 2012

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Billy Jones

So where were Greensboro's "civic leaders" in 1959 when RTP was being established? Oh wait, I know, they were busy "attracting jobs" by building the Greensboro Coliseum Complex. And now they want to repeat their failures by building a downtown PAC. Talk about putting the cart before the jack asses!!! They put the cart before their entire herd of jack asses!!!

Do we need any more proof that Greensboro is being lead and has been lead for over half a century by absolute morons? Many of them with criminal intent. Where are the men like the Cone Brothers, the Bryans and the Richardsons with vision and drive and the will to make it happen without living on corporate welfare and seeking every chance to rip off the taxpayers?

Billy Jones

What else was Greensboro's "civic leaders" doing circa '59? How about bulldozing a recently annexed thriving East Market Street business district so that they could eliminate competition for their beloved Downtown Greensboro.

The sins of the father?

justcorbly

I'm curious if plans for RTP were received with applause across the board 50 years ago? I'm sure they weren't. How many people saw the notion of attracting northern techies as a silly idea when "everyone" knew that the way for NC to grow was to get more mills and furniture factories?

A new downtown Durham hotel would help the city distinguish itself from that mythical flyover place called "Raleigh-Durham".

BTW, even downtown Carrboro is getting a Hampton Inn. It's about a 5-minute walk down Franklin Street from Chapel Hill's "downtown" hotel.

sittinginthemiddle.

Can't wait for the millions of people who will flock to our fair city once we have a new PAC and downtown hotel, that's the real reason they are not coming now.

The Morons keep chirping.....

Ron

won't be long before we hear talks about the downtown Wyndham hotel re-surface, particularly if the PAC moves forward.

Billy Jones

One also needs to remember that RTP was also paid for in large part by state funding and by funding from multiple municipalities on privately owned land that was donated to the cause. To date, we've seen no interest in state funding or funding from other cities for Greensboro's PAC or the hotel Ron, the shill wants to pitch again today. Nor have we seen any wealthy downtown landowners willing to donate land.

Add to that, RTP is and has always been unincorporated and is banned by state law from being incorporated or annexed by the cities that surround it. In other words, while it is a great model for development that will help grow the local economy, it is the one model out "civic leaders" most detest and find it the hardest to profit from.

So while King Perkins is currently pointing to RTP as a model for his planned development of the A&T University Farm in closed door conversations, RTP it will never be. Not even a candle.

Thomas

Wow. Our civic leaders were screwing things up when they were still in diapers. A talented bunch

Billy Jones

Thomas wrote, "Wow. Our civic leaders were screwing things up when they were still in diapers."

No, but in many cases their parents were training them.

Hartzman

"Our civic leaders were screwing things up
when they were still in diapers."

Seems to be many of those that inherited the money.

I wonder what Ceasar Cone would think
of Roy, Robbie, Randall and friends actions
as to the best use of other people's tax money.

What would Edward R. Murrow who came from Greensboro think?

How about Bryan or Koury?

I believe many of the named and more named
would not be very happy with thier offspring etc...'s,
blatent attempts to seek rents from everyone else,
to pocket line.

Ashamed even.

Fred Gregory

Can anybody tell me the occupnacy rates for GSO hotels ?

And please Billy it is Lord Perkinks not King. He is imperial but just in his own mind. Mike Easley and his wife suffered from the same delusion.

Ed Cone

Fred I don't have occupancy rates handy, but if you look at the posts under the Hotel Bond Fun! tab in the righthand column of this page you will find plenty of evidence that the market is not begging for new entrant.

Also, iirc, the specifics of ownership and cost at the existing downtown hotel allow it to go incredibly low on room rates should the need arise.

Andrew Brod

That's right, George. Edward R. Murrow was a well-known constitutional conservative.

sal leone

I dont think Greensboro needs more Hotels, are that many people visiting greensboro right now.

Thomas

I've only lived here for 26 years, so some of you have much more Gate City history from which to draw. I just found it amusing that we learn Durham might offer incentives for a downtown hotel and...Abracadabra!...once again Greensboro's leadership has failed. Fifty-three years ago.

Seems like an automatic reaction on a myriad of topics.

Billy Jones

Ed wrote: "Fred I don't have occupancy rates handy, but if you look at the posts under the Hotel Bond Fun! tab in the righthand column of this page you will find plenty of evidence that the market is not begging for new entrant."

And yet Greensboro's "civic leaders" Ron, the shill and development classes, along with Lord Perkins (Hat tip, Fred) all seem hell bent on building excuses to build more downtown hotels. Wonder what that is? (Something in the bottled water perhaps?)

Thomas seems to miss the entire point. Greensboro's "civic leaders" have long touted their ideas as progressive and forward thinking but as history has shown, their ideas have proven to be anything but. So what are they proposing currently? More of the same failed ideas.

Too often, history repeats itself-- especially the bad parts.

As another example of our current crop of "civic leaders" and their "forward thinking" they are currently trying to build publicly financed but privately owned industrial parks on the eastern and western Guilford County lines 10 miles outside city limits while pointing to RTP as an example of the prosperity it might bring. But they fail to mention that the land upon which RTP was built was donated and the project was paid for in large part by the entire state of North Carolina. No where in their current proposals is mentioned free land and state funding. As a matter of fact: it is the "civic leaders" who own the land and plan to sell it to the highest bidder after Greensboro taxpayers foot the bill to develop said properties.

And they also fail to note that RTP and Global Transpark are both not yet filled to capacity even after all these many years.

In other words, it ain't nothing like RTP and the Durham hotel project ain't nothing like any of the recently proposed downtown Greensboro hotel projects.

You see, Thomas, it's about learning from failures, not simply repeating them.

Billy Jones

Andrew wrote, "That's right, George. Edward R. Murrow was a well-known constitutional conservative."

The blackmailer plies his trade.

ron

Apparently there is a demand for more hotels in Greensboro. One is going up at the intersection of I-40 and High Point Rd. My guess is that we will see the planned downtown luxury hotel back in the media once the PAC bond pass...wink wink.

ron

you know those guests that stay at luxury hotels have to have some form of entertainment nearby to suit their tastes.......

bubba

"you know those guests that stay at luxury hotels have to have some form of entertainment nearby to suit their tastes......."

I don't know, ron. Now that the Greensboro Inn is closed down, where are the Eliot Spitzers going to frequent for their Lewiniski-style entertainment?

Billy Jones

Ron,
Had there been any real demand for high end hotel rooms in downtown Greensboro, the Greensboro Inn would have long ago raised its rates, improved its rooms and catered to a higher class clientele. Now it's up to the downtown Hilton to take up the slack left by the now closed Greensboro Inn. I guess the prostitutes and drug dealers will simply have to raise prices to compensate for increased operating costs.

The fact that the Greensboro Inn, which was in continuous operation for well over 50 years, could not rise above the sort of clientele that got it forced out of business is indicative that downtown Greensboro is not going to need any new hotel rooms in the near future.

As for High Point Road @ I-40? Closer proximity to I-40, the Airport, the Koury Convention Center and Grandover all dictate a higher need for rooms in that area than in downtown. Thus the reason that most of Greensboro's hotels are clustered in that area.

Apparently Ron is but another blackmailer plying his pathetic trade.

Again Ron, Do you work for, contract to or are compensated by in ANY way by ANY of the principals involved in ANY of the downtown Greensboro proposals?

Remember: No answer is an admission of guilt.

ron

Billy there are a number of attractions downtown as well, not to mention the amtrak station. Look at the Proximity and O'Henry hotels. The only thing nearby is a shopping center and those hotels are miles away from the interstates, convention center and airport. Yet those two hotels are more successful than most. So no hotels don't have to be near the interstates, Koury Center or the airport. There is more activity going on downtown than most areas of the city so I would say a luxury hotel within walking distance of restaurants, bars, lounges, theater and other forms of entertainment would do quite well. It would stand out from all the other hotels in the city.

Billy Jones

Ron,
Okay, why don't we look at the Proximity and O'Henry hotels, both less than 10 minutes from the airport and the Interstates via Bryan Blvd and next door to Greensboro's largest, most successful shopping center of all time-- the shopping center that all of Greensboro's wealthiest shoppers go to to do their shopping. And well withing walking distance of several restaurants.

As for downtown attractions? Not many people will travel across the country to go to a bar or restaurant because bars and restaurants are found everywhere in every city and town in America. And bars and restaurants make up the vast majority of downtown Greensboro's so called, attractions. Other downtown attractions include the Civil Rights Museum but it doesn't appear to to be attracting anything like the numbers of people it was predicted to attract. Seriously, is there anything in downtown Greensboro that you would travel across the country to see? And if so, what? That is what makes an attraction an attraction and downtown Greensboro ain't never had it, ain't got it and ain't never going to have it no matter how much money we spend. Greensboro don't have a river, get back on the bus.

Have you been drinking again?

Again Ron, Do you work for, contract to or are compensated by in ANY way by ANY of the principals involved in ANY of the downtown Greensboro proposals?

Remember: No answer is an admission of guilt.

ron

Billy people come to Greensboro for various reasons. But having amenities like I mentioned within walking distance to a hotel gives people a reason for staying at that hotel while they are in town for other reason. Beside why should you or anyone care now that bonds are not going to be used to build the hotel. Its going to have to built the good old fashioned way...with private dollars.

Billy Jones

Ron wrote, "Beside why should you or anyone care now that bonds are not going to be used to build the hotel. Its going to have to built the good old fashioned way...with private dollars."

So I take it you are privy to certain information the general public has not been made aware of. In other words, as myself and others have suspected all along, you are a paid shill.

You're right, if it's paid for with private money I don't care. Now let's see how you do with private funding for that PAC you need built before the hotel can be become profitable. You see Ron, with downtown Greensboro's current hotels currently vacant most of the year you're going to need a new downtown attraction before any new hotel is needed. Hence, the reason you and some others want to build the PAC.

Ed, are you paying attention to Ron's admissions of guilt? Proof positive I was right all along. Imaging that, Billy Jones, right again, as usual. And are you also aware that myself and the other "naysayers" just saved Greensboro taxpayers about $70 Million Dollars and forced private doners to step up to the plate?

That, or Ron is an out and out liar. You decide.

Ron, have you been drinking again?

Again Ron, Do you work for, contract to or are compensated by in ANY way by ANY of the principals involved in ANY of the downtown Greensboro proposals?

Remember: No answer is an admission of guilt.

And I think everyone reading already knows the answer.

Ron

Billy I love to get you stirred up.

Mick

Billy,

No one cares. You have made sure of that.

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