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« House of Dues | Main | Truth in advertising »

Oct 26, 2011

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Bill Yaner  N

Doesn't look a lot different than Tunisia, does it?

Ron

the OWS people need to show their anger at the polls.

Mad Dog

"Casini was wounded when she returned with others to try to retake the plaza after the "second or third order to disperse." -from the link above.

I can be 100% totally constitutionally in the right, but if a police officer tells me to disperse two or three times, then maybe I should disperse.

MD

Brian

Last I checked Ron, we don't vote for CEO's and banker barons. If you are an OWS supporter, which party are you supposed to vote for? When one of the parties make a motion that they "get it" and take actions to address some of OWS' issues, then and only then you might see some coalescing around a party, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

Lex

MD, no offense, but ask John Lewis how that approach worked out.

What we saw in Oakland was a police riot, full stop. And as with firehoses and German shepherds in the 1960s South, the more people see it, the more their consciences are shocked, the more things will change. It would be nice to see the offending cops go to prison. Won't happen, of course. But if people comply every time authority gives an illegal order, not only does nothing change, you end up with stuff like Abu Ghraib.

That's not to say some individual protesters didn't break the law; I'm certain some did. And it's not to say some -- some -- of the OPD's violence wasn't justified (self-defense, resisting arrest, whatever); it might well have been. But what we saw went way beyond that in both quantity and quality.

A hypothesis: We saw police officers attacking what they fear becoming, and they fear becoming protesters because they know that the anti-union movement is under unprecedented pressure, for good (Calif. prison guards have gotten way too powerful) and evil (Wisconsin and Ohio public workers are being attacked for no good reason) purposes, and that for once not even they are safe: Their jobs, benefits, pensions and futures are at the same risk as everyone else's now.

Lex

Whoops; "... the anti-union movement is ..." should be "... public-sector unions and public employees generally are ..."

Need. coffee.

Billy Jones

So the camp was broken up for a clean up. Before and after the clean up.

Mad Dog

Lex,

Can't comment on John Lewis because I do not know that to which you allude.

I'm not debating legal vs illegal orders. I'm only saying that there are two sides to every story and discretion is sometimes the better part of valor. Again, if a police officer tells me to move on two or three times, I probably won't debate the issue at that point. Kinda like standing in the middle of the street with a 3,000 lb vehicle bearing down on me and not moving because pedestrians have the right of way.

We all make choices and sometimes the consequences of our choices don't turn out like we think they should have.

MD

Ed Cone

Or as the Mayor of Oakland thinks they should have.

Ron

Obviously the OWS are angry about the greedy banks and the high income earners getting big tax breaks. If I were an OWS member, I would be voting for the democrats because the GOP is all about big tax breaks for the rich. If Perry becomes the GOP nominee his tax plan will hurt him in 2012 because his plan calls for one of the largest tax breaks for high earners in U.S. history. The deficit would skyrocket.

RBM
Police said they did not use rubber bullets in the clash with protesters but many of the demonstrators said they had the bruises to prove otherwise.
- LA Times

Well what caused the damage to the Vet, then ?

This was the best I found:

The antiwar group said Olsen suffered a skull fracture when he was hit by a "blunt object."
SF Gate

That article indicates more than Oakland police were involved in the police effort.

Anyone have anything more definitive ?

Billy Jones

More here!

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