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« Ponzied | Main | BROTD »

May 29, 2009

Comments

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Britt Whitmire

Ratcheting up the old Greensboro vs. W-S battle, eh? What's next, a comparison of the killer acts coming to the Greensboro Coliseum vs. the shite that's booked at LJVM?

Don Moore

Greensboro's stadium was paid for by Private Investors and some limited public funds. Greensboro Coliseum runs in the RED Big Time.

Winston-Salem went for public funding match; but their Coliseum doesn't suck the city dry.

By the time the Winston-Salem Stadium is finished they will have balanced everything out and Greensboro will continue to operate the Coliseum in the RED.

Two different cities - Two different situations.

Tom Phillips

If you look at the W-S budget, you will see transfers from the general fund to the LJVM budget, as well as, the Benton Convention Center.

Ed Cone

Always interesting to see how people read things.

I really didn't think about my post as GSO vs W-S. Is there such a contest? My comment about the GSO stadium was a gentle poke at GSO's never-satisfied attitude.

And then along comes Don to tell us for the millionth time that he doesn't like our coliseum, thus exemplifying that attitude better than I ever could. The coliseum, which returns a ton of money to the city in visitor spending and publicity, is sucking us dry by costing less each year than we spend on mowing the grass in our parks (which also don't turn a profit)? Sure it is, Don.

winstongator

The people of GSO, especially those who whine about Action Greensboro and the stadium need to look west to see a real problem. Not only was the new stadium not done, but attendance at Ernie Shore is way down - in the hundreds for the 2 games I checked. Lost ticket revenue is probably in the neighborhood of 3k*70*$5, or about $1Mil.

Part of the problem was Prim was late to the party. Had he needed to secure more financing in 2007, it would have been no problem - Fall 2008, not quite so easy. Lesson - if you've got a big plan, do it early in a boom when financing is plentiful.

What happens if the stadium is not done by March? Do you think the 2009 season ticket holders will 'renew'?

Bubba

"The coliseum, which returns a ton of money to the city in visitor spending and publicity,is sucking us dry by costing less each year than we spend on mowing the grass in our parks (which also don't turn a profit)?"

I think the general point is that the Coliseum is SUPPOSED to make money, but does not.

The old "returns a ton of money to the city in visitor spending and publicity" is generally what we expect to be trotted out by certain parties whenever favored publicly funded civic boondoogles are criticized.

It's a first cousin to the "quality of life" and "attracting business and the professional class" talking points that we hear whenever there's a new and wonderous bond issue to be passed

Ben Ledbetter

I think the stadium needs to be built, even if it is without all the extras that were in the original plans.
Maybe a couple thousand seats could be added, I don't know.
I have never been to Ernie Shore Field, so I can't comment about that.
Let the Dash play there, let Wake Forest and possibly any other college baseball team play its big games there.
Forsyth County American Legion baseball teams could also play their big games there, too. This could be another playoff site for high school and legion baseball teams.
The American Legion team in Sumter, S.C. plays its games that once housed the Sumter Braves/Flyers franchise that played in the South Atlantic League.
The last time I saw Riley Park, it was showing its age, but I think a park for amateur baseball teams might be a good way to use the space.

Ed Cone

Is the coliseum supposed to make money, or is it supposed to run as efficiently as possible while providing a significant amenity and numerous ancillary benefits to the citizens of Greensboro?

Obviously, we'd all prefer it to run in the black on an operating basis. But I don't think its value is measured strictly on a P&L basis.

Kim

Ditto Ed. $1M out of a $400M budget. Other than basic services, this is one place I don't mind my tax money going to. Besides the economic benefits, it is a place I enjoy, just like a city park.

Bubba

"Obviously, we'd all prefer it to run in the black on an operating basis. But I don't think its value is measured strictly on a P&L basis."

On what basis was the major coliseum renovation bond sold to the voters?

I believe this took place before my time, but I seem to remember others who were around at the time later complain about the way the business model presented bore little semblance to the actual business in practice.

Ed Cone

Bob, I'm not sure which upgrade you have in mind -- there's been a lot of work done over the years. My impression is that Matt Brown is a tough guy in a tough business, and that he runs the coliseum pretty well.

Bubba

Some of the fans of the old AHL Greensboro Monarchs might dispute your assessment of Matt Brown.

As far as the funding for the Coliseum remake, I'll ask some of the old timers what they remember.

Bubba

The renovation I was thinking about took place in 93-94, if Wikipedia's entry is accurate.

Ed Cone

No doubt the Monarchs are missed. Bringing in the 'Canes did not work as planned -- I remember getting really great seats to see big-name NHL stars as a game-day walkup.

But I don't think that misstep defines the whole Matt Brown era.

I'm a taxpayer, and a Greensboro native, and I'm happy to have the coliseum here.

Bubba

"But I don't think that misstep defines the whole Matt Brown era."

I think some folks blame him for not making sure the original deal with the Hurricanes was not completed. That part would be the return of the Monarchs/Beast from New Haven to function as a Hurricane farm team in the AHL.

It would have been a natural for all concerned.

As far as the Hurricane's era, I was one of the few who had season tickets (on a shared basis). The best memories of that era included a modestly talented workhorse Hurricane squad beating the reigning Stanley Cup champion Detroit Red Wings in 98, and the uncharacteristic tossing of the Great One, Wayne Gretsky, on a game misconduct in 99.

Brown needs to put together an AHL deal. That might go a long way to curing the perpetual deficit at the end of Lee Street.

Bubba

The last post should have read "....I think some folks blame him for not making sure the original deal with the Hurricanes WAS completed.

Spag

The coliseum just needs more WWE and Springsteen. Face it folks, you are talking about two small to mid size cities with no professional sports teams. If you don't like it, you can always move.

Greensboro is getting left behind because Raleigh and Charlotte have grown significantly in the past 20 years and both have pro teams now. Before, there was a rough equality that no longer exists.

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