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« Fragment, shored | Main | Tips and tipping fee »

Aug 30, 2012

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Andrew Brod

Um, yeah. We all do.

I've already addressed the AMS thing. Either you didn't understand my response, or you didn't care about getting the facts straight. You're not a dumb person, so I infer it was the latter. But that doesn't sound ethical. Aren't you supposed to be the ethical one?

Speaking of getting the facts straight, your statement that "Pigs, Poultry and Politics is a political campaign activity with both state and local politicians" shows that you haven't researched this. My understanding is that candidate forums do not constitute "political-campaign activity" as long as they don't endorse, favor, or show a bias for particular candidates. The fact of hosting such an event isn't enough for this to be a tax problem for TREBIC. You have to show that it's a particular kind of event.

Temple Emanuel has, on a number of occasions, hosted neutral candidate forums. They did not endanger the Temple's tax-exempt status.

Hartzman

http://hartzman.blogspot.com/2012/09/pig-poultry-politics.html

Says Political Rally.

"rally

v. ral·lied, ral·ly·ing, ral·lies

1. A gathering, especially one intended to inspire enthusiasm for a cause: a political rally.

1. To call together for a common purpose;
assemble: rally troops at a parade ground.

1. To come together for a common purpose.

2. To join in an effort for a common cause:"
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How is Pigs & Poultry a candidate forum?

Do they ask candidates questions,
and give equal time for answers?

Who introduces the candidates to the donors?

What happens to the "outside looking in" candidates
at these "forums"?

Does Marlene introduce them to Roy Carroll? wink wink.
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What's more interesting in your response Andrew,
is what you chose not to respond to.

Lobbying the state house on RUCO.
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Why does the invite say"

"Are you a member of:
(Check all that apply)  TREBIC  GBA  GRRA RCA  HPRAR  HP RCA  NAIOP  PTAA
 Other __________________________  None of the above"

http://www.trebic.org/images/PPPwDates12.pdf
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"The fact of hosting such an event
isn't enough for this to be a tax problem for TREBIC."

What is your proof of this allegation?

"You have to show that it's a particular kind of event."

Who should the burden of proof be on?



Hartzman

"Temple Emanuel has, on a number of occasions,
hosted neutral candidate forums.

They did not endanger the Temple's tax-exempt status."

Exactly Andrew.

Is Pigs & Poultry neutral?

Why was that the first time you used the word "neutral"?

Andrew Brod

It sounds as though you don't know what PPP is. Perhaps you should find out. You might just learn that you're right. As of now, you haven't a clue.

Hartzman

"Pig, Poultry and Politics"

Thursday, October 13, 2011
4:30 - 7:00 p.m.
Crystal Garden @ Castle McCulloch
3925 Kivett Drive in Jamestown

Tickets are $30; will be $35 day of the event

This Event is not open to the general public."

http://trebic.org/pigspoultrypolitics/purchasetickets.html
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Andrew, are you saying you know something I don't
but you won't tell?

What am I clueless on Andrew?

Is PPP Pigs & Poultry?

Are most "candidate forums" not open to the public?
.
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Forgot about lobbying the state on Jordan Lake Rules.

http://trebic.org/newsinformation/jordanlakerule.html


Hartzman

...Dr. Brod's recent clients include:

• Brooks, Pierce, McLendon, Humphrey & Leonard, Greensboro, NC
• Womble, Carlyle, Sandridge & Rice, Charlotte, NC
• Nexsen Pruet Adams Kleemeier, Greensboro, NC
• Forman Rossabi Black, Greensboro, NC

http://andrewbrod.com/
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Any TREBIC members?

Hartzman

Looks like TREBIC doesn't want transfer taxes
passed by the state legislature.

I wonder how much Marlene has lobbied who at the state level
on this one.


"Transfer Taxes in NC:
In 1986 the NC Legislature authorized a 1% transfer taxes
in 7 counties, and 5 of them have instituted the tax. 

Since then, no other transfer taxes have passed.  

There are no transfer taxes authorized in the Triad region."

http://www.trebic.org/documents/transfertax.pdf

Andrew Brod

My reading of the IRS regs is that if no bill regarding transfer taxes is pending, then talking to legislators about transfer taxes is not deemed lobbying.

Hartzman

If your reading of the IRS regs
is that if there was a bill regarding RUCO pending,
then talking to legislators about RUCO
was deemed lobbying.

Andrew Brod

Yes, I believe that's true. Lobbying is defined as influencing or attempting to influence legislation. If there's no legislation, then from the perspective of the IRS, there's no lobbying.

So. Was there a bill pending when those conversations took place? I don't know. Perhaps you should investigate that before you spew more innuendo.

Hartzman

This is the investigation Andrew.

It's a blog thread where ideas are spewed and rebutted.

In public.

You seem to be trying to censor via insult.

Please see Roch for more instructions.


Hartzman

North Carolina Lobbying Laws

http://www.secretary.state.nc.us/lobbyists/legislation.aspx

§ 120-47.1. Definitions.

The term "legislative action" means the preparation,
research, drafting, introduction, consideration, modification,
amendment, approval, passage, enactment, tabling, postponement,
defeat, or rejection of a bill, resolution, amendment, motion, report,
nomination, appointment, or other matter by the legislature
or by a member or employee of the legislature
acting or purporting to act in an official capacity.

The term "lobbyist" means an individual who:
a. Is employed and receives compensation,
or who contracts for economic consideration,
for the purpose of lobbying; or
b. Represents another person and receives compensation
for the purpose of lobbying.

§ 120-47.9. Punishment for violation.

Whoever willfully violates any provision of this Article
shall be guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor.

In addition, no lobbyist
who is convicted of a violation of the provisions of this Article
shall in any way act as a lobbyist for a period of two years
following his conviction.


Hartzman

"Are any “gifts” to “covered” state officials
permitted under the state gift provisions?

Yes. Gifts that fall within one of the following categories
and meet all requirements of the related statutory exception are permitted:

1. Food and beverages for immediate consumption
in connection with any of the following:

A...gathering with at least 10 or more individuals in attendance
open to the general public,
provided that a sign which is reasonably designed
to convey that the gathering is open to the general public
is displayed at the gathering."

http://today.duke.edu/showcase/reports/nc_ethics.pdf
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PPP was not open to the general public.
.
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Food and beverages for immediate consumption and related transportation
provided all of the following conditions are met:

o The food, beverage, or transportation is given by a lobbyist principal
(i.e., Duke) and not a lobbyist.

...The written notice must also state whether or not the gathering is permitted
under the gift ban exceptions,

for example:

“This gathering is in compliance with our understanding
of the requirements and restrictions of the North Carolina Ethics Act
and Lobbying Law, NCGS §138A-32(e).”

...you must report:

• The per-person cost of food and beverages served at any gathering
attended by one or more “covered” persons

• All expenses related to a “covered” person’s participation
in an educational meeting, seminar, conference, panel presentation
or similar event
.
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I have forwarded this thread to lobbyist@sosnc.com
.
.
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http://www.secretary.state.nc.us/lobbyists/pdf/Advisory%20Opinion%20L%2008002.pdf

Andrew Brod

I'm not trying to censor you. Say what you will, to whomever you like. It's no skin off my nose.

David Hoggard

"I have forwarded this thread to lobbyist@sosnc.com."... who will send it directly to the round file mainly because it is both boring and full of crap.

Andrew Brod

DH, if that happens, it'll just prove that the Secretary of State is in on the conspiracy. TREBIC's tentacles reach everywhere!

Hartzman

"full of crap."

really David?

what's full of crap and a conspiracy?

Name the conspiracy?

where is the innuendo?

I feel as though I am being pretty clear.

I believe TREBIC illegally lobbied the state on RUCO.

I have provided evidence and applicable law.

Is that innuendo?

I believe PPP has been an illegally performed event
and I have said why.

Is that crap?

I believe many who deducted donations to TREBIC
did so without not deducting what they should have
and I have provided evidence.

Where is the conspiracy Andrew?

Where is the crap David?

If this info was boring
you shouldn't have bothered to read it david.

David Hoggard

I didn't read anything vertically written, and only had to scan the authorship to smell the crap preceding it.

Boring crap.

Hartzman

Uninformed, you.

Just wanted to say something rude
to confirm your existence?

I suppose having written what I have,
you have achieved your objective.

Congratulations.

Brian

I just read between the Hartzmans. Everything else is unintelligible as I imagine it will be to the SOS as well.

prell

Hartzman, has anyone ever accused you of being stubborn?

Roch

George sent me a link to this thread. Here was my reply:
---------
Please write four paragraphs with what you think is important in this thread.

You may not:
1. Use the passive voice.
2. Pose a question or use a question mark.
3. Quote from other sources without explaining why you are quoting them and explaining their relevance.

You must:
1. Have a subject for each sentence.
2. Put line breaks only between paragraphs.
3. State the facts clearly.
4. State the implications clearly.

Your four paragraphs will conform to the following format.

Paragraph 1: Will introduce the subject, describe what you are about to explain and tell us why it matters.

Paragraph 2: Will detail the substance of what it is you want us to know.

Paragraph 3: Will add to and/or expound on the information in paragraph 2.

Paragraph 4. Will tie it all together and tell us how the information in paragraphs 2 and 3 support the assertions you made in paragraph 1.

The entire piece will be 500 words or less.

Mick

So GH and Co aren't banned from Gso 101?

They just refuse to abide by your guidelines?

Haven't I seen this post before?

Hartzman are you being untruthful?

Lies by omission are still lies, are they not?

Does anyone really care?

Hartzman

"Egotism is the anesthetic that dulls the pain of stupidity."

Frank Leahy

Mick

Answer the question George.

Have you simply refused to abide by the above rules?

If so... why?

There could be a good reason.

In any case I think you should stop indicating you are banned by Roch and admit you are in self imposed exile.

"Obstinate people can be divded into the opinionated, the ignorant, and the boorish"

Aristotle

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